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Asia in this Context is Asian Minor which at the time of writing was held by Rome and is also identified as Asia in Revelation 1:4
Mystery Babylon is the Roman Empire, 2 Esdras above is speaking about Constantinople which the Ottoman Turks vanquished. The Roman Empire at the time contained the cities of the 7 churches in Revelation 1 and 2. Those 7 churches were cities within the Roman Empire at the time of writing.
Just as the Bride of Christ as a woman is a church, so too is the Whore and the Harlot daughters. The Bride of Christ is the true Church. The Whore and the Harlot daughters are false churches. They take the name of Christ, but they don't follow the Commandments of God. Specifically, they reject the 4th Commandment and in doing so they break all of the others too.
Luke 6:46
"And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say?"
Matthew 15:9
"But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men."
Mark 7:8
"For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do."
Isaiah 4:1
And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach.
These Harlots and the Whore wear polluted Spiritual clothing. They eat Spiritually polluted bread. (They taint and serve polluted teaching as if it were the word of God) They claim to be Christian, but are Christian in name only, because they reject God's Commandments and teach doctrine of men in it's place. Those 7 women are the churches in Revelation 1 and 2. That man is Jesus Christ. The Whore is the Roman Catholic Church and the Harlot daughters are the churches that broke away, IE. Protestant, Baptist, etc... All keep Sunday rather than Saturday as Commanded and practice pagan rites/idolatry.
Islam, Christianity and Judaism were these three factions. History shows that they all played a major role in Asia Minor, the Levant and Israel. The entire region was under the rule of these three throughout history and can be confirmed through the study of such. The center head of the Eagle I believe is Israel as indicated by the scattering of the people at the destruction of the 2nd temple and the other empires conquering of it. The head on the right consumes the head on the left, so I think this was the Ottoman Empire overtaking the Byzantine Empire. In order of context of history this melds well, but without going back and looking and studying more and going through what I already have researched again I am going to be moderate in my solidification of my stance on this.
Notably also, Esdras is told that the vision of the Eagle is the same as the vision given to the prophet Daniel.
The feathers and wings are in fact rulers of the monarchies, republic's and empires of these three religious factions or of the center head or a combination of the three. In any case, most of what pertains to this vision has already taken place, up until the lion roars. Then we have a fourth beast mentioned, which I believe it the RCC, Mystery Babylon which is the remaining body of the eagle. I do have the identifying characteristics of the historical leaders recorded in a saved file with their counterpart wings and feather, that precisely align with the narrative. I may share those, but the content of the information dealing with that is very large and the allowed room for sharing things on here in the text box is extremely small, so I would need to condense my research first. Also links are not allowed so that presents a challenge to citing my sources and evidence.
The Ten Commandments, and most certainly the 4th, has nothing to do with the Church of Christ Jesus. Please consider Exodus 31:12-18. In that passage, there are three distinct occasions where the children of Israel are spoken of & that they alone were to keep the Sabbath Day holy. It was never given to the Gentiles, & certainly not to Christ's Church. True, there were imposter Churches around then as also today, but the marks of their falsehood are not seen in the keeping of the Ten Commandments, rather in the preaching of a defective Gospel and their incorrect understanding and handling of the Word of God.
Where the Decalogue was given to Israel to obey, or where even our Lord told the people to "keep the commandments" (e.g. Matthew 19:17), all was done because the Law was still in force & the New Covenant in Christ's Blood was not ushered in as yet. Once the price for sin was paid & accepted by the Father, only those believing in Jesus to save them from the awful penalty for their sin, could be redeemed, saved, given new birth by the Holy Spirit, and come under the New Covenant administered by the Spirit. 2 Corinthians 3:6-11. The Old has been abolished, which is the Law (contained) in ordinances (Gk. dogmasim) ( Ephesians 2:14-16).
When we read below, we are shown that the Covenant law is distinct and separate from the sin laws which came 430 years later as clearly shown in verse 17. Those later additions were sacrificial laws and days set up to be observed for sin offering and the days created pertaining to them, due to sin. They were not given by God, but added because of men's transgression. They were added by men, not God.
Galatians 3
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.
18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
The law questioned in the incipient part of verse 19, specifically applies to this part of verse 17; "the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after".
The law questioned in verse 19 above, doesn't apply to the Ten Commandments, which is discussed in the first part of verse 17.
With some reading comprehension; There are in fact two distinct laws being discussed in verse 17. The first is The Covenant Law of God The Ten Commandments. The second discussed is; what was added 430 years later due to sin of men, and added by men.
Galatians tells us it is those later additions that were to be removed by Jesus, but they would remain until Jesus did away with them, however, Jesus, Himself, tells us that God's Covenant law will remain in effect until the heaven and earth are removed.
Thank you Woe for your detailed response. If I might begin at the start of your comment. You referred to Galatians chapter 3 & Exodus 34:28. The Covenant that God made with Abraham (otherwise called the Abrahamic Covenant) had nothing to do with the Ten Commandments ( Ex 34:28 doesn't indicate that at all). The Abrahamic Covenant is found in various portions in Genesis 12:1-3; Genesis 15:18-21; Genesis 17:1-22; Genesis 22:16-18. The Ten Commandments were never given to Abraham; Abraham was commended for his faith & obedience, outside of any Law. He only received the Promise.
Galatians 3:17-19 which you quoted. Verse 17 particularly: "And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect". The comparison here is made to the promise of God to Abraham (the Covenant), that the Ten Commandments were given 430 years after God's Promises to Abraham. So, there aren't two Laws, just one given at Mt. Sinai - what was given to Abraham wasn't the Law but the inheritance by Promise. (cont'd on Page 2)
We are told in Genesis 26:5 below that Abraham did in fact keep the Commandments of God. The laws for sin were not part of that Covenant and were added later after Israel came out of Egypt. It is those laws that Jesus came to do away with, not God's laws Abraham already was keeping, established by God at Creation.
Genesis 26
5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws. 6 And Isaac dwelt in Gerar:
God confirmed a Covenant with Abraham, but the same Covenant made with Abraham was then made with all men, because God found all men to be in unbelief. The Jews thought they were heirs to the promise, but scripture says it was to the One Seed, Jesus. that the promise was made in Galatians 3.
You can't claim to have the faith of Jesus if you also do not walk as He walks. Jesus tells us to take up our own cross and follow after Him. He was our example. Jesus spoke about our fruit and told us a good tree bears good fruit. Hence the fruit of the Spirit is to keep God's eternal law which brings no condemnation, but avoid works of the flesh which do.
Galatians 5
18But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law. 19Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, 20Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, 21Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. 22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, 23Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
25If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.
Thanks for your further comments Woe. It is correct that "Abraham obeyed my (God's) voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws" ( Genesis 26:5). But when did all these commandments, statutes & laws given to Abraham? If God covenanted with Abraham concerning blessing, inheritance, & multiplication of his seed (as per the Genesis references I gave previously), where in Scripture do we find that these Laws (particularly the Decalogue) was ever given to Abraham? Could these laws, commandments & statutes be different to what was given at Mt. Sinai, regulations that pertained specifically to Abraham's life & direction he was to take? Not to say that something of the Mosaic Law would not be included in that giving to Abraham, but we are not told specifically what was given, therefore we are not at liberty to assume or presume (which is a fundamental biblical rule).
No, Jesus doesn't "tell all men to keep God's 10 commandments". He was speaking to the Jews who were under the Law - Gentiles & the Church never received the Law & were never brought under it. Where we find in the NT about believers needing to obey God's Commandments (as in 1 John 2:3, 1 John 5:3), it is spoken as to those not under the Law but under the Law of the Spirit. And the Holy Spirit will certainly bring before us God's Commandments, and many, many more than the few in the Decalogue that pertained only to Israel who had long forgotten the God of Israel when in Egypt ( Exodus 3:13,14). The Ten Commandments were given to a discouraged enslaved people who had lost all knowledge of God & His requirements - given to them to show God's Standard of worship & godly living, but ultimately to reveal to them their sin, their need to trust & hope in the Living God & their need of a Savior.
Concerning a Friday crucifixion or Sunday resurrection, I won't get into that here, except to quote Luke 24:1, "Now upon the first day of the week.." And that is a Sunday, which follows the seventh day of the week, a Saturday/Sabbath.
You did well to quote Galatians 5:18-25: showing that we are not under the Law, which means that we are free from its ultimate purpose: that of revealing human spiritual & mental frailty & resulting condemnation. If we break even one Law, we have broken all & remain condemned ( James 2:10). There was nothing wrong at all with the Law ( Romans 7:12), but its purpose was to lead men to Christ, not to be resurrected again by those now in Christ as some sort of rule book to follow & please God by. The only way to please the LORD is to do His Will, following the dictates of His Holy Spirit He has given us. If we use the Decalogue as some sort of yardstick to measure our spiritual standard & acceptance to God, then we have failed & missed the whole point of Christ's Sacrifice & the great matchless worth of the New Covenant in His Blood. Thank you for your time.
We have clear evidence in scripture that the women who wanted to attend to Christ's body with spices couldn't, because the Sabbath drew on and Christ was placed in the tomb. Then after the sabbath they went and bought spices, took them and prepared them, which would have taken a great deal of time and then again rested on the Sabbath, Saturday, which began at Sunset on Friday. Why? Because there were two Sabbath in the week Jesus was crucified. Furthermore a biblical day begins at sunset and ends at sunset. You might not want to get into it, but it is an imperative that the crucifixion week is evaluated properly as it dispels the false teaching that Jesus was crucified on a Friday. Not only that, but in Christ's own words, He would be in the tomb for 3 days and 3 nights as Jonah was in the belly of the whale. This is a full 72 hours. So Christ was placed in the tomb at sunset on Wednesday, Thursday was the High annual Sabbath of Passover. Friday was preparation for the weekly Sabbath and the weekly Sabbath began at sunset in accordance with scripture that a day begins and ends at sunset. Christ was then Resurrected at sunset on Saturday, just as Sunday began to dawn and the sun began to set. As the sun went down, Mary came to the tomb and found Christ had already risen. It was the earliest she could go after the Sabbath had ended. Christ rose on Saturday as the day came to an end. Christ did NOT rise on Sunday. He was already risen prior to the time Sunday began, which was at sunset of Saturday. Scripture tells us that the disciples were gathered in the room on Sunday for fear of the Jews. They were not meeting or holding a worship service. They were hiding.
Well Woe, we were still dealing with the Decalogue & its applicability to the Church (are we done with that?), so that is why I didn't want to side track towards the dates of the burial & resurrection of Jesus. But since you have brought it up, let's proceed.
I always begin with what we already know (from Scripture), and that is the Day of Christ's Resurrection. Mark 16:1,2,9: "And when the sabbath was past, Mary Magdalene, and Mary the mother of James, and Salome, had bought sweet spices, that they might come and anoint him. And very early in the morning the first day of the week, they came unto the sepulchre at the rising of the sun. Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils".
In these verses, we read that Jesus was resurrected early on the first day of the week (v9), that the two Marys would have rested on the Sabbath Day & prepared their spices (as you mentioned), and as soon as it was morning (actually, still dark - John 20:1) after the Sabbath, these women came to the sepulchre. Some have swapped the commas here, to read: "Now when Jesus was risen, early the first day of the week he appeared". Even if one does that, with the Jewish day reckoned from sundown to sundown, the Sabbath would have ended about eleven hours before, thus confirming that Jesus didn't arise from the dead on Sabbath Day, but on the first day of the week, Sunday. Onto Page 2.
Again we look at what Jesus says and may I remind you these are not idle words;
Matthew 5:18, Jesus states, "For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth pass away, not a single jot, not a stroke of a pen, will disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."
Heaven and earth have not yet passed, so true to word, God's Ten Commandments remain.
If I could first address your last point here ( Matthew 5:18). Do you think that the previous verse (v 17, "Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil"), has some connection to verse 18? Clearly, Jesus is upholding the Law (i.e. what was given by God, & not those spurious laws the religious leaders imposed upon the people). He also states that the Law will abide forever. And He further states that His Coming to Earth was "to fulfil the Law (Gk. for fulfil is 'pleroo': to bring to completion). Yes, the Law was Perfect from both the Mouth & Finger of God, but Jesus came to finally cast aside what the Law was designed for & its intent, (and NOT its value & truth), which ultimately brought men under condemnation; Jesus came to fulfil the Law (& only He the sinless Son of God could), bringing it to finality & abolishment, thus ushering the New Covenant in His Blood. Two Covenants can never operate simultaneously, particularly where one led to hopelessness, helplessness and death; & the other availed to give life, hope & power in the Spirit.
Even Hebrews 8:13 reminds us of the finality of that Law: "In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away". And if we read earlier in Hebrews 8:10, "For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people". (see also Jeremiah 31:31-33). Onto Page 2.
Matthew 5 17Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. 18For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled. 19Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
All things have not yet been fulfilled and heaven and earth still stand. Below is the fulfillment Jesus was talking about. He wasn't talking about His Crucifixion and Resurrection. The key to understanding that scripture is that heaven and earth must pass away first before the law, Gods Law changes.
Revelation 21
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6 And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
Woe, since your responses are scattered in this thread, I will refer to them individually rather than collectively.
We again refer to Matthew 5:17-20. The questions we must ask when reading this passage (or, any passage of Scripture) is, 'what is being referred to here?' Verse 17: 'Law & the Prophets'. Jesus is referring to what we understand is the breakdown of the Tanakh, namely, the Torah (the Law - Pentateuch), the Nevi'im (the Prophetical Books), and the Ketuvim (the Writings - others). Here, Jesus speaks only of the Torah & Nevi'im, and these He would not destroy (nor will they ever be destroyed), until all is fulfilled by Him. If you agree to this understanding, then we have a basis to proceed.
The Law that Jesus referred to, was not simply the Ten Commandments, but all the Law of God given to Israel, just as 'the Prophets' could not be restricted to certain prophetical books but to all that was given to Israel for their present & future state. If we restrict the Law to the Decalogue only, then we are presuming that this was of much greater worth than the other Laws given by God. Whereas, the Decalogue was a brief snapshot given to a people, once under the rigors of slavery & hardship, who had all but forgotten the Living God Who had never forgotten them. The Decalogue was a reminder to them of God's essential requirements for His people as they made their way to idolatrous Canaan, also showing to them that the Law could not ever bring about the desired outcome for holy living, simply because sinful flesh can never fulfil what that Law demanded (being "weak through the flesh"); that the Law should have pointed to them of their need of a coming Savior, to condemn sin in the flesh, providing an escape from a Law that only entrapped the soul, not giving life (see Romans 8:3,4). Onto Page 2.
But only the righteousness of the Law could be fulfilled in us - how? By holding onto the Law of sin & death? No, by those being led by God's Spirit, He Who applies the Law in a continual, greater & more perfect measure in those who belong to Christ.
And yes, God's Laws are eternal ("till the heavens & earth pass away"), but Jesus has fulfilled them for us perfectly (not just the sacrificial aspects only but what Israel & us could never keep from the Decalogue) & thus He was the only Sacrifice that could avail for us. If Jesus failed, we would fail because of the Law's demands - and there would be no hope for mankind. Why should we appeal to a Law that only revealed our sin & brought death, rather, we ought to listen & obey the Spirit of Life Who tells us daily, constantly how to obey & please the Father.
So, I understand your reference to Revelation 21:1-5, pertaining to the Law that is eternal. But do we neglect the many passages, which I've already quoted, that show us the finality of the Law & its demands at the Cross, as Jesus ushered in the New Covenant administered by the Life-giving Spirit (without the Law's weaknesses & leading men to death)?
The Laws that a converted Israel would receive, would no longer be as those formerly written on stone, but now 'in fleshy tables of the heart' ( 2 Corinthians 3:3). The Old has decayed and vanished away, only because of Jesus & His institution of the New Covenant. Let us not abide by things that are from the old economy, as even now, priests still wear religious garb & mitres, with their incense lamps as did the Jewish priests of old, rather to embrace what God's Spirit has for us in our hearts & lives, never leading us into condemnation.
As for your reference to Matthew 12:36-42, I'm not going to debate that, for I believe as you do, in what Jesus said about His death & resurrection relating it to Jonah's entombment in the 'whale'. The issue is first with the references I gave earlier, viz Mark 16:1,2,9, with John 20:1 complementing it. If the two Marys came "very early in the morning on the first day of the week", & "it was still dark", that tells me that they had arrived at the sepulchre to anoint Jesus' Body before dawn broke on the first day of the week (Sunday). Yes, the Jewish Sunday started after sundown Sabbath, but it still was Sunday when morning broke. You stated: "The earliest they (the Marys) could come to the tomb and administer the spices was as Saturday ended that very evening and Sunday began to dawn, which occurs at SUNDOWN. So Mary came at sundown Saturday." If Saturday (Sabbath) ended in the evening, the dawn of Sunday was still 10-12 hours away; if a day dawns, it is when the sun begins to rise - the day cannot dawn straight after the sun sets the previous day. This shows that the women came up to 12 hours after the Sabbath Day ended (i.e. the next day, Sunday). So I don't get your timeline here.
And just a final personal, maybe rhetorical, question: do you consider yourself to be wholly subject to the New Covenant in Christ's Blood, or do you believe it is necessary to embrace both the Old & the New to be right before God?
Two covenants cannot run together!
This reminds me of Matthew 9:14-17.
John's disciples were Jews. They were still following the rules of Judaism and living under the obligations of the Old Covenant, with its ceremonial rituals and religious regulations, including fasting on certain days
Leviticus 16:29-31
Leviticus 23:32
Luke 18:12.
Jesus came to usher in the New and fulfillment of the Law and do away with the ( rituals and Foreshadowing ) ministry that veiled their Hearts.
There also is a Change in Priesthood!
Hebrews 7:11. If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
Blessings.
Yes, Jesus is High Priest of the order of Melchizedek. He is the only intercessor between man and God. No man on earth holds any position higher than any other man and no man on earth sits in Jesus' stead or can absolve sin. No man is to take on the name Father in a religious fashion. There are only those who study and are on milk and others who are on meat. Then there are others who consume and/or share tainted word and still others who any and all reject religion outright. There are three major religious faction in the world. Islam, Christianity and Judaism. All three are in error and teach deceptive and/or contrary doctrine to Christ.
Judaism seeks to hold onto the Old Covenant which is done away with. Christianity seeks to replace the teaching of Christ with the doctrines of men and Islam seeks to rewrite the biblical narrative into their own false account. All three are called to Convert. If the Commandments of God are taken out of the way, there isn't anything to convert to. Jesus came to establish the law, not do away with it. What law? God's law. Jesus says if you want to enter into life keep the Commandments. They are not burdensome or difficult. This is what He demonstrated to us. Furthermore, before Abraham and Moses, there was also other ordinances that we know God instituted and meant to be kept. Unclean and Clean animals for example. God says He is Holy, we must be Holy too. He calls unclean animals an abomination. Noah was told to take 7 pair of clean animals onto the Ark. 2 pair of unclean. God established this ordinance. Noah was aware of what unclean and clean animals were. Likewise, Gods 10 Commandments also were established by God prior to the Covenant made with Abraham. Don't think that you can do abominable things or defraud God of what He Commands. There is no law against doing good and following God's law is good. Christ didn't remove God's law. He removed sin laws, days pertaining to them and sacrifice for them.
Thanks brother S. Spencer and for your further references. I certainly liked the Matthew 9:16,17 where our Lord essentially reminded John the Baptist's disciples that you can't mix the old with the new, or else the product desired would be lost & destroyed. As Jesus had now come, He came to bring in the new life (embedded in His Everlasting Covenant), that those who believe in Him for their salvation might be now clothed in His Righteousness (without any fragmentation or wear), and the Holy Spirit given to reign in redeemed hearts & lives. Calling upon the old garments & old wineskins now can only be detrimental & bring confusion to those wanting to live in the Spirit.
I also realize that much of biblical teaching, whether received in childhood or from the pulpit, can sometimes be superficial, thus more readily received. I am guilty of being one of those unfortunates. But after re-birth, my heart was set to really study the Scriptures for what they said in entirety with the Spirit's guidance & help, & not pander to what I was once fed. I found that most of those people were themselves not prepared or unable to go deeper into the Word, so they could only issue forth generalities: such as, we must obey the Ten Commandments as Christians, or other matters concerning the Triune Nature of God, or even His eternal Judgement. We must be prepared to look past the superficial or what is convenient & palatable, and look deeper, theologically/exegetically, into such important teachings. Onto Page 2.
That is why, when in a discussion such as this, I take all Scripture into account, ensuring the basic elements of the subject are foundational. I find that if the foundation is incorrect or wobbly, then whatever is built thereon will very likely totter over & crumble. So, even when I say that the Decalogue, or all of God's Commandments were given to Israel & no one else, I know that it will immediately raise eyebrows by those who believe (or, taught) otherwise. And that is why we then delve into the Word to learn further. So, even through extensive discussions we might never come to agreement (& this is most often the case), we at least have presented arguments in support of our beliefs, for our learning, understanding & for any other interested reader's benefit. So no Ego here, neither with you nor me, just bringing out the Word of God.
Yes, in the mind, it is nicer & more convenient to have a set of rules to follow & gauge one's standing before God by it. But if we study further, we find that the ministry of the Holy Spirit takes us far far deeper into God's requirements for holy living than what the Decalogue or any of the Laws given to Israel could ever do. So why do we then insist on holding onto the old cloth & old wineskins?; they're only good for us to see what the old life was once like, I'm sure. These are the questions I had to deal with early on in my Christian experience without the aid of anyone or even the internet - just sitting with God's Word. If I'm in error, a proper exegesis of the Scriptures would help us all greatly & not just beliefs carried over from the past. Blessings to you brother.
Mark 16:9-20
King James Version
9 Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
The comma is placed in the wrong spot. It should read thus;
9 Now when Jesus was risen; early the first day of the week he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils.
Notwithstanding; The women followed and watched Jesus placed into the tomb and the stone rolled in front of the door.
Scripture clearly tells us they placed Jesus body in the tomb in haste, because the sabbath drew on. It was so close to sabbath that the women would NOT have had time to prepare spices until after it was over. Doing so would have been a violation of the sabbath. They had to wait until Friday to buy and prepare spices, which was a lengthy process and since Jesus was already in the tomb, Friday was the only day they could do it.
Then, they again had to wait, because the weekly sabbath began at sundown Friday. They earliest they could come to the tomb and administer the spices was as Saturday ended that very evening and Sunday began to dawn, which occurs at SUNDOWN. So Mary came at sundown Saturday. Since a day is from sundown to sundown; it therefore would have been very early Sunday morning and still dark. Again, at sundown Saturday ended and Sunday began. For a day, the morning of a day in biblical terms doesn't coincide with our modern day view of how days begin and end. Mary in our modern definition would have actually came to the tomb Saturday night in our current reckoning and this is why it was still dark out when she did.
Matthew 12:39 Context
36But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. 37For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned. 38Then certain of the scribes and of the Pharisees answered, saying, Master, we would see a sign from thee. 39But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: 40For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. 41The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here. 42The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.
So now, do you think that Jesus said what he did in idle fashion?
Jonah 1:17
"Now the LORD had prepared a great fish to swallow up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights."
As for what you posted, it is a misnomer. A day starts at evening and ends at evening. There is a mistranslation in scripture. It's not as the sun began to rise ....it's as the new day began to dawn or spring forth, or up. Mary came to the tomb as Saturday ended and Sunday began, which was SUNSET. When a new day begins!
The following verse is a more accurate description and translation.
John 20:1
"The first day of the week cometh Mary Magdalene early, when it was yet dark, unto the sepulchre, and seeth the stone taken away from the sepulchre."
Without debating the actually day of Christ's crucifixion (whether Wednesday, Thursday or Friday), the point here is if Jesus was resurrected on the Sabbath (the 7th day) then Sabbath-keepers might be emboldened to honor that day (i.e. in rest & worship). But if Jesus was resurrected on the Sunday (as the Scriptures tell us), then it shows that the Church was not bound to the Old Law but to the New Covenant, and was free to worship on any day. And Sunday, the Lord's Day, was set aside for these followers of Christ to gather together aligning with their Savior's resurrection & victory over sin & death.
The fact that the Church, in its infancy, still attended the synagogue ( Acts 2:46) is important, until the formation of 'house-type Churches' meeting on a Sunday, the first day of the week, of which we read in Acts 20:7,8 and 1 Corinthians 16:2.
The RCC admits that they changed the day of worship to Sunday. However, God never gave man the authority to do so. This change was not enacted by Christ. Nor was Christ resurrected on Sunday. People make these claims because they are ignorant of the other scriptures that help reveal these things. Many simply look at the scriptures surrounding the crucifixion timeline, never considering there is other scripture elsewhere that provide necessary keys to establishing that timeline correctly. So they err due to their ego driven ignorance, thinking they understand things when in reality they lack the wisdom and due diligence to discover these hidden things to reveal the mystery and importance of including those thing into the crucifixion narrative. There is a narrow path that is missed by a majority of people and most enter the broad path.
Thanks again for the reply, Woe. I have already shared why I believe the first day of the week was Jesus' resurrection day - and from the Scriptures given. And yes, I have received the evidence you have shared, & found it faulty in light of the Scriptures. Even 'God establishing the Sabbath Day at the close of Creation', is incorrect, as we only read that 'God rested (ceased) from His Work, blessed the seventh day and sanctified it (set it apart)' ( Genesis 2:1-3). But the Sabbath was only given at Mt Sinai to His people. If we say that Genesis 26:5 proves without doubt that the Laws & Sabbath remembrance was given to & observed by Abraham, then this belief must only be an assumption, since there is no Scripture to tell us what was given to Abraham. Even if I had to guess what Laws, commands & statutes were given to him, mine too would just be a guess - and that is the sort of thing I avoid most vehemently, as it only breeds error & simply adds fuel to those desperately searching for verses to support their position.
The only clear Scripture relating to Christ's resurrection on the first day of the week is found in Mark 16:9 (to which we have found disagreement previously). Maybe a Greek scholar can confirm how they understand that verse, (taken from my Lexicon), whether
'Anastas de proi prote sabbatou, ephane proton Maria te Magdalene..' is read better,
or Anastas de, proi prote sabbatou ephane proton Maria te Magdalene..' is better read? Maybe, that might help us further.
The RCC may have changed the day of worship, according to them I presume, but Church history informs us that the early Church fathers in general, believed that the First Day of the Week was the occasion to worship & commune together. The Didache (Teachings of the Apostles), Ignatius of Antioch (AD 110), Justin Martyr (AD 155), & John Chrysostom (AD 395), are a few who held that view. Cont'd on Page 2.
And the latter's (Chrysostom) Homilies on Galatians 2:17 is particularly telling, which I quote here:
"For though few are now circumcised, yet, by fasting and observing the sabbath with the Jews, they equally exclude themselves from grace... You have put on Christ, you have become a member of the Lord and been enrolled in the heavenly city, and you still grovel in the law [of Moses]? How is it possible for you to obtain the kingdom? Listen to Paul's words, that the observance of the law overthrows the gospel, and learn, if you will, how this comes to pass, and tremble, and shun this pitfall. Why do you keep the Sabbath and fast with the Jews? Is it that you fear the Law and abandonment of its letter? But you would not entertain this fear, did you not disparage faith as weak, and by itself powerless to save. A fear to omit the sabbath plainly shows that you fear the Law as still in force; and if the Law is needful, it is so as a whole, not in part, nor in one commandment only; and if as a whole, the righteousness which is by faith is little by little shut out. If you keep the sabbath, why not also be circumcised? And if circumcised, why not also offer sacrifices? If the Law is to be observed, it must be observed as a whole, or not at all."
Just forwarding the above, not only for the abolishing of the Law as pertaining to its currency post-Cross, but more particularly, that rejecting the Sabbath is not some new thing, but an observance by the early Church & those who belonged or taught since those days.
I hope you don't mind. Concerning the crucifixion and resurrection days, if we compare all the gospels, all four give the clearest truth.
In John 12:1-12, we learn that six days before Passover, Jesus visited the house of Mary, Martha, and Lazarus in Bethany. The following day, He rode into Jerusalem, five days before Passover. This event was significant because it coincided with the 10th of Nisan, the day the lambs were selected and held until the 14th when they would be sacrificed for Passover, the same time Jesus died on the cross, Exodus 12:1-14. These Passover lambs were eaten the night of the 15th the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread the day Israel went out of Egypt.
Sunday Matthew 21:1-17, Mark 11:1-11, Luke 19:28-22:7, and John 12:12-50.
Monday, Matthew 21:18-19 Mark 11:12-19 This was the 11th, four days before Passover the 2nd day of the week.
Tuesday, Matthew 21:20 to 26:2 Mark 11:20 to 14:2 This was the 12th, three days before Passover, the third day of the week.
Wednesday, Matthew 26:6-16 Mark 14:3-11 Luke 22:1-6 This was the 13th, and at sunset is Passover day the 14th. The Last Supper, the arrest, sent to Pilot, the crucifixion, and placed in the tomb were all on the 14th, Passover day. Friday would be the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread.
Jesus was in the tomb Thur. Day, Fri, Night, Fri. Day, Sat. Night, Sat. Day, Sun. Night, three days, and three nights. Jesus rose on the first day of the week and fulfilled the Feast of First Fruits, Leviticus 23:10-14 This coincides with what Jesus told Mary, touch me not, He had not ascended to His Father, John 20:17. The Feast of First Fruits as we see is on the first day after the Sabbath after Passover Day.
If Jesus was crucified on Wednesday, the women could have gone to the tomb on Friday because Friday is a preparation day for the weekly Sabbath.
God bless,
RLW
Sadly, no, Jesus rose on Saturday just as the sun began to set.
You are very close to the correct timeline though.
Rather than explain myself, I will allow someone who has already done the research and fact checking to do it for me this time. I am tired and have been awake for many hours or I would normally do it myself.
To get a detailed and concise narrative with scriptural context copy and paste the following into your browser and hit return then click the first link to United Church of God and you will receive the context of what I believe, even though I am not a member of this organization.
SEARCH THIS PHRASE>>>> Jesus Wasn't Crucified on Friday or Resurrected on Sunday: How long was Jesus in the tomb?
Please share your thoughts after you finish reading. Thanks.
I read the article you shared and would like to clarify a few points regarding the Passover. According to Luke 22:15-16, Jesus wanted to eat the Passover with His disciples before He suffered, but He did not partake in it He knew He would die at the same time as the Passover lambs, so He would not be there on the 15th.
In Exodus 12, we see that lambs were killed on the 14th of Nisan, known as Passover Day, which is also a preparation day for the 7-day Feast of Unleavened Bread that begins on the 15th. The Passover meal was consumed on the night of the 15th.
John 18:28 shows that on the 14th, the same day Jesus had the Last Supper in the morning the priests would not enter the judgment hall because they would be defiled and could not catch the blood of the Passover lambs and pour it into the altar or eat the Passover if they were defiled.
The article's author is mistaken in claiming that Jesus and His disciples ate the Passover on Tuesday, as Scripture does not support this.
In summary, the 14th of Nisan is Passover Day and a preparation day for the Feast of Unleavened Bread, which begins on the 15th. The lambs were killed in the evening of the 14th any time after the sun started to go down.
Scripture is clear there were 5 days from when Jesus rode into Jerusalem to when He was crucified, the Scriptures should show if studied in my other post. He rode in on the first day of the week and He was crucified on the fifth day of the week this is what the Scripture tells us.
God bless,
RLW
Instead, I observe the Lord's Supper, which was instituted by Jesus in it's place.
Verse 14 of John chapter 19: "And it was the preparation of the Passover, and about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King!" No doubt they are preparing for the Passover. It is approaching.
Jesus & the Disciples kept the Passover far earlier in the day, as the day began so it was many hours earlier than those who betrayed Him. They all kept it, but Jesus did it much earlier. Jesus did it at the start of the day. The Jews did it later in the day near sunset. Jesus' trial and Crucifixion happened fast. From betrayal to Crucifixion it was about 6 or so hours. So sometime near the end of the first 12 hours of the day, give or take, Jesus was placed upon the Cross. Remember a day starts in the evening as it begins to grow dark.
John 18:28: Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: & it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the Passover.
Jesus was on the cross as the lambs died.
Jesus was placed in the tomb at Sunset the 14th, just prior to the Sabbath which began at Sunset. So hour 1 of the 15th began at sundown at about 7pm.
Counting forward. 24 hours, we are at Sunset on the 15th at about 7pm. So hour 1 of the 16th began.
Counting forward 24 hours and we are at Sunset of the 16th. Which was Friday. At Sunset Friday, Saturday begins at about 7pm.
Counting forward 24 hours, just prior to Sunset Saturday, Jesus Christ is Resurrected, fulfilling the 72 hours He told us He would be in the grave. He is raised from the tomb the same time He was placed in the tomb.
3x24 is 72. This is THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS, JUST AS JESUS STATED.
At Sunset on Saturday, Sunday begins about 7pm. At this point, Jesus has already left the tomb and been Resurrected.
I understand there are different understandings on this, many go with the tradition Jesus was crucified and put in the tomb on Friday and rose on the first day/Sunday. Others like yourself hold that Jesus was crucified and placed in the tomb on Wednesday and rose on Saturday before sunset.
The whole account is in all four gospels the Scriptures I listed in my first post if we study it. It was 6 days before Passover day when Jesus went to Bethany the following day He rode into Jerusalem on the first day of the week 5 days from Passover day. Jesus went back to Bethany that night. The next day Jesus returned to Jerusalem, the second day of the week/Monday.
Jesus returned to Bethany that night and returned to Jerusalem the next morning the third day of the week/Tuesday. Jesus returned to Bethany that night and returned to Jerusalem the next morning the fourth day of the week/Wednesday.
Jesus left the temple and went with His disciples to the Mount of Olives where we read the Sermon on the Mount. He sent Peter and John to make ready the upper room where they had the Last Supper this would be the beginning of the fifth day of the week/Thursday.
This was Passover day when the lambs were to be killed, and preparation day for the Feast of Unleavened Bread a holy convocation/Sabbath, John 19:31 John calls it a high day. That is the reason they had to put Jesus in a tomb, not because of the weekly Sabbath but the first day of the feast, there were two Sabbaths back-to-back.
Jesus rose on the first day of the week/Sunday on the Feast of Firstfruits, the first day after the weekly Sabbath after Passover, Leviticus 23:10-14.
People then and today call Passover or the feast of Unleavened Bread an 8-day feast but the first day is the 14th Passover day when Jesus was crucified, a preparation day. The 15th and 21st are the Sabbath days or holy convocations.
Not sure I can say anymore, in the scriptures are the truth what Jesus did is what matters.
God bless,
RLW
Nicely laid out!
I also believe there were 2 Sabbaths that week. "The weekly Sabbath and perhaps the yearly"
Matthew 28:1 may suggest that.
"In the end of the "SABBATH" as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre..
From my research "Which may or may not be correct " In the original the Sabbath used here in this verse is in the Plural. (Sabbaths)
Also, this may have been the year of Jubilee
Jesus may have made reference to this in
Luke 4:18-19. "The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Just a thought
God bless you Brother.
Thanks, brother. I hope all is well. I'm unsure about the Year of Jubilee; it might be worth looking into since we know it was a reason for the Babylonian exile.
In my opinion, what makes this topic challenging is that during the time of Christ, the Jews referred to the festival as 8 days by two different names: the Feast of Passover and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. This distinction can be seen in Matthew 26:17 and Luke 22:1, while Mark 14:12 mentions the first day of Unleavened Bread as the time when they killed the Passover lamb.
Today, we see all eight days on the calendar referred to as Passover. However, this is not how it was originally structured. Passover day is the 14th, when the Passover lambs were sacrificed, and it is also the day Jesus was crucified. This day is not a Sabbath or holy convocation or a feast; rather, it is a preparation day for the seven-day Feast of Unleavened Bread, which runs from the 15th to the 21st. The first and last days of this feast are designated Sabbaths, as noted in Exodus 12:16.
The first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread is the Sabbath that John mentioned. Jesus had to be placed in the tomb before sunset on Thursday, which was Passover day. The first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the 15th (Friday), is referred to by John as a "high day" or "high Sabbath." Consequently, both Friday and Saturday were considered Sabbaths.
Not sure why the Sabbath is plural, but Scripture is clear there were two Sabbaths, Friday the first day of Unleavened Bread, and Saturday, an annual Sabbath, and a weekly Sabbath.
Have a great day.
God bless,
RLW
This is a interesting study that I haven't spent a whole lot of time on.
What I do find interesting is-
Jesus was our passover and he was crucified on the observed day those lambs were slain.
Jesus is the first fruit of the ressurection.
the feast of the first fruits predicts the resurrection of Christ and his fulfillment of the feast is on that observed day.
Not only are these feast predictive, they are fulfilled on the day they were observed.
Matthew 28:1, "In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre."
Let's see the grk." Opse(late or after) de Savvaton(the Sabbaths), te epephoskouse(as it begun to light) eis mian Savvaton(towards the first of Sabbaths)..."
Lets write it in English. Late (of after) the Sabbaths as it begun to give light towards the first of Sabbaths..."
Well it seems that we have a contradiction here. Because initially it says that the Sabbath was to be gone or just gone and next it says that as the Sabbath was gone the first of the Sabbaths was or just started to show. Why is this?
Because the first Sabbath is meant to be the day Sabbath and the second Sabbath is meant as a week. So the KJV correctly translated as "the first day of the week"
Compare it with Luke 23:54 and it gets very clear. According to Luke it was late at Friday (Preparation) not long before the Sabbath starts (which means not long before getting dark)
The plural form has to do with how the Jews expressed it in their language. Every language doesn't express meanings in an identical to all languages form.
I've never looked deeply into it due to lack of time and resources.
When it comes to this topic I'm glad we all can agree on what's important.
Christ died and was raised on the 3rd day!
Blessings to you Brother and thanks for all that you do.
22 Now the feast of unleavened bread drew nigh, which is called the Passover.
......................
7 Then came the day of unleavened bread, when the passover must be killed.
8 And he sent Peter and John, saying, Go and prepare us the passover, that we may eat.
You said;
"The lambs were killed in the evening of the 14th any time after the sun started to go down."
You realize this statement is in error.
The evening of the 14 is in fact the 12 hours prior to sunset. At Sunset on the 14th it is officially the morning hours of a new day. It is officially the 15th. Since the 15th is a Sabbath, the lambs would NOT have been slaughtered after sunset.
A day begins and ends at Sunset.
Matthew 26:2 Ye know that after two days is the feast of the passover, and the Son of man is betrayed to be crucified.
Matthew 26:3 Then assembled together the chief priests, and the scribes, and the elders of the people, unto the palace of the high priest, who was called Caiaphas, 4 And consulted that they might take Jesus by subtilty, and kill him. 5 But they said, Not on the feast day, lest there be an uproar among the people.
Tuesday would have ended at about 7pm, Sundown. Wednesday would have started at about 7pm, Sundown.
We will call it hour 1.
Beginning at about hour 1 Jesus and His Disciples would be eating the Passover. The meal likely would have lasted about 3 hours or less. After the meal, Jesus and the Disciples went to the Garden of Gethsemane. It would have been dark. Even though it was a new day, and the new day had dawned at 7pm, it was still the night time portion of it. After about 2 hours of prayer, the soldiers came and arrested Jesus. Which means only about 5 hour of the new day had gone past so far.
In biblical sense, it was 5am or hour 5, when Jesus was arrested. If we were to look at it in by modern definition Jesus's arrest would have occurred at 12 midnight.
This is why people have trouble with the scriptures. They get the time wrong.