What is "fear of God". Should we, His children, "fear God?"
In the past I was troubled by having two different feelings. One feeling that says that God is your dear Father who loves till death and a feeling that says that God is a fearsome, powerful God, with whom one should keep a distance from. After all He is God, not a man. Two opposite feelings.
One time as I was trying one more time to think what is the proper way to approach and think of God, I just asked my wife what she thinks of it. And she said something very simple to me," how would you like your son to see you and approach you?" And I said that I would like my son to love me, to appreciate what I have done for him, to trust me that I want the best for him and to respect me as a father. I would never liked that my son fears me, I would feel like a failed father if that had happened. So she said it is the same with God. Love Him, trust in Him, appreciate what He has done and doing for you and respect Him like a Father but do not fear Him. He wouldn't like this. Fear God means respect God as a Father.
So we should not fear God BUT we should fear about our salvation and be very serious about it. Philippians 2:12, "12Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." Let us obey God, let us not play games with sin, be careful, stay away from anything that could turn us to a different direction than that of the narrow way, along Jesus' footprints, which ends up in Heaven, Every other way leads somewhere else, not in Heaven.
I should fear God, just like I fear my parents. I do my best to love and have a high respect for my earthly fathers, in the same or similar manner I believe I should respect and reverence God our Father. Now when the earth moves, and the waters are troubled and the wind and rain are hard to bear I can wonder is God trying to tell me something or get my attention. These calamities get my undivided attention, however although I believe these are acts of God I believe the cause most of the calamity is the sin in the earth atmosphere that puts these events in motion. I believe there is negative energy that is created from sin in the earth that triggers and puts negative events into motion. (now the negativity could be coming from any part of the earth not necessarily stemming from where a calamity has taken place)
I also believe God doesn't have fear, I believe only man has fear. My fear is an emotion, to help me to know or learn what I may be feeling. My fear helps me know not to do certain behaviors due to consequences, for example. Fear is a tool to help me learn however I should not abused fear, love also is an emotion that I can use to learn and I shouldn't abuse either.
The scripture tells us that God hates sin, man being born in sin, etc. is separated from God due to man's sin nature, Ah Ha, God provided an answer to remedy my separation from God and to bring me back in relationship with God, that remedy is salvation in Jesus Christ. The word salvation comes from salvage, God had a plan from the beginning to salvage my relationship with God.
I asked God why so much challenges, I believe I understand that God wants us to be like Him. His only begotten Son Jesus the Christ is our template. In order for me to be like God, I must go through trials and tribulation to best understand God by way of my own personal journey and personal relationship with God, disregarding the interference from others.
You wrote " I believe there is negative energy that is created from sin in the earth that triggers and puts negative events into motion."
This is actulaly what Paul says in Rom 8:19-22, "19For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. 20For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until noW"
This world and the events that occuring is the result of man's disobedience in the Paradise. Nothing good, sin is dominating everything and everywhere. Apart from God's people. We belong to the Kingom of God and we are under His protection. Of course this doesn't mean that God has placed us inside a glassy cage where nothing touches us, we are still living in this sinful world and we are going through all that the rest are going through. But there is aiways a limit that God does not permit to exceed. And there will be a day that all that will end and we will be living on the new earth that He will create for us full of hapiness for ever. And with this hope we keep going in this life. Blessings.
Brother Giannis thank you for those worthy thoughts. And yes, your wife certainly gave you a great illustration in the role & attitude of a father to his children. One thing though that came to mind (& coming from left field): I realize that this is a 'non-Scriptural' thought, but how do we perceive or visualize our Father God in Heaven. We do have several glimpses, especially in The Revelation (mainly in chapters 4, 5, 7), about those elders, angels, & beings around His Throne worshiping Him - is that how we generally perceive this state in Heaven?
Speaking from my own perception, and given whatever the Word reveals about the presence of God & His Character, I don't at all sense that He is a happy-go-lucky father figure, entertaining humor & jokes from the beings of Heaven, or even joining in the activities of Heaven. I realize that some believers may sense the opposite to what I do and that's okay, since I feel that after all, it can only be an individual's perception, unless we've had an Isaiah or Paul experience.
Therefore, the "fear of God" speaks to me of an Almighty, Holy, Everlasting God Who ever exists, thinks, behaves, & causes things to happen both within & without, in a way that is far removed from what an earthly father (or, man) could ever be, whether to his children, family or others. Yes, as we can run to our earthly father to express ourselves or needs, so too we can approach our heavenly Father in & through His Spirit within us. But the fact of the very Nature of God & His relation to all His creation, and without any similarity to our humaness, our God is truly to be feared for His Majesty, Wisdom, & Power. Do we just hold Him in awe & reverence, or do we (or should we) come before Him as those beholding His Glory, as no earthly father can produce or expect? Maybe, if we do receive a vision of His Glory, then the word "fear" will hold a greater, compelling, & worthier meaning to us. Blessings.
This is the problem brother. If one fears God since His is an Allmighty God, a God that millions of angels worship, and cherubims hide their faces infront of Him etc, then it is impossible for one to approach God as a beloved Father. For them God will always be a fearsome personality. Fear keeps one away from another person.
But inspite of all those, which are true, God is love. He is a "person" that descended from His highness in Heaven, He became one of us, not any man but a poor man, and tolerated so many bad things from people even accepted to be crucified, He actually aimed that. So we also speak about a humble God who emptied Himself from His powers and rights, full of love for mankind, ready to sacrifice Himself for us.
Jesus is God who became a man. Did His disciples or any other person fear Him? No, I don't think so. They were feeling a deep respect for Him, but no they were not afraid of Him. John in the last supper threw himself into Jesus' arms. That one can never do if they feel a fear, an awe for somebody.
Maybe I am wrong Chris, but I prefer to consider God the way I am considering Him, a dear father who is not hard to approach, ready to throw myself into His arms. I could not do this if I feel even a little bit of fear. Fear would always keep me away. Of course this does not mean that I could play and joke with God. No I do not mean that.
Well, I will be thinking of your comment. Thanks brother. GBU
Thanks bro. Giannis for these further thoughts for contemplation. I fully understand what you're saying here, in respect to how one should look to God as our heavenly Father Who reached down to us, emptying Himself to demonstrate to us & effect His great love for us. So then it would seem incongruous to accept that such a loving God could also instil a 'fear' of Him in us. In regards to Jesus coming to Earth as a Man, we know that He laid aside His Glory for that to happen & become a Sacrifice for us; and as a Man, His disciples saw Him, touched Him, & spoke to Him, and probably only much later realizing that His Words were true, that He was indeed the One sent by the Father, from Heaven and Divine. That knowledge in itself should have prompted a special reverence towards Jesus that may not have been there before.
As Isaiah 6:1-7 reveals what Isaiah saw & experienced, even though we don't consider him to have that same salvation experience nor the Father-child relationship as we have, yet we do get a glimpse of how he was struck by this vision. So I sense that type of fear that was beyond a holy reverence, yet certainly not a fear of One Whom he should be fearful of & flee away from. From my understanding of the Word & my approach to it & before the Father, I cannot perceive Him as equivalent to my earthly father (deceased). Elements of such a relationship are similar, as we have discussed previously, but there needs to be something much greater & deeper than the earthly perspective. Onto Page 2.
Just as a side note: I don't know how the Greek refers to God (in the second person); i.e. is the same word used for 'you, your, yours', in Greek like we have in English? In the Indian sub-continent two main languages (Hindi, Urdu), different words are applied depending on whom we are speaking to. Whether speaking to an adult/respected person, or a child/servant, or to God, different words are used. In the Bibles used there, and not translated from the KJB, (Tu, Tera) are used of God & equivalent to our 'Thou, Thy, Thine'). It was thought inappropriate to use the generally 'better/acceptable' words for 'you' when addressing God in the Word or even in prayer (even as I still do). And why should this be, if we ought to consider God as a Father-figure to us with Whom we should easily relate to at any time, & little else?
I guess, that our own understanding of this matter reflects how we think of God in His Majesty & Power, how we read His Word, or address Him. It remains therefore one's personal belief in understanding this aspect of God and in no way belittling or condemning another for believing differently. The LORD still loves us & accepts us fully in and through His Son. GBU.
He does reveal himself in a more "noticeable way" if only we knew what to look for... the churches have done a less than poor job of this however, Christ (Yeshua) did explain it. ">If ye love me, keep my commandmentshe shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; even the Spirit of truth< whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you." John 14:15-17
Grace is not unmerited favor, it is the spirit of conviction your heart to obey. (G5485) it's NOT "legalism" it's LOVE ( 1 John 5:3) We've got to be obedient to his 2 covenants of promise (10 commandments and rainbow covenat "eat clean") thats what Christ(Yeshua) magnified and made honorable, just like his very own character and life was pleasing unto God(Yahovah) he opened the door for all nations to enter that covenant verbally presented and agreed to at the rock at Horeb, and *then* written in stone at Mt Sinai. but Israel had already transgressed that agreement ( Exodus 19 & 20) when Moses came down with the 10 commandments in writing. *then* the sacrificial law was added until Christ(Yeshua) would finish the punishment with a perfect sacrifice, effectively restoring the original covenant (10 commandments.) Moses prophesies about ending the punishment of the sacrificial law here in Deuteronomy 18:15-19 but never did the eternal 10 comandments go away. now because the 10 northern tribe were scattered into all the world via mixing seed(mixed offspring) the covenant is open to ALL nations and people. There's many false gospels and dangerous doctrines of men, mixing holy and profane, teaching traditions as commandments while tossing out the actual commandments, ( Matt 24)
this is why he said "narrow is the path, few will find it." - Matt 7:14
Love your neighbor according to scripture - James 2:8 what scripture? Leviticus 19:15-18.
To be honest I don't understand what you want to say. Do you mean if we use plural when we talk or pray to God like we do when we talk to an adult/respected person? The answer is no we don't. We use plural (in grk "you" in singular is a different word from "you" in plural) when talking to a respected person but not for God. Generally speaking we use the same words for God as for any other person.
I'm sorry brother if my answer was confusing & I can see why. What I was trying to show, was not about plural forms, but of different words used when speaking or referring to different types of people. You wrote that (in Greek) "we use the same words for God as for any other person" (though in singular or plural forms); so I assume the word is the same, but for God, you use the singular form of it. Whereas in those languages I mentioned earlier, they have a whole different word for various types of people. So, if one used a word for 'you' as when speaking to a child, but used that same word to a respected person, this person could take offence to your language. Hence, a different word was used of God in the Bible (& when praying) that revealed that He could not be spoken to as a juvenile or even a respected person, but only as One that was far above the human level, to be respected in fear. Again, I don't mean 'fear' as in 'dread', but holding to an attitude rightly deserving to such a Mighty God.
Rather than focussing on grammar (which is helpful), the point of this thread is 'how should we understand God's Nature, as both One of great Majesty & Power yet now approachable by His blood-bought children calling Him 'Abba'? This apparent dichotomy is probably only resolved if God Himself by His Spirit, reveals something more of Himself to us, that might cause us to combine a loving Father-like figure with One before Whom all should tremble ( Psalm 99:1-5). Here then is where i see both the similarity & difference when comparing our LORD God to our earthly father. True, both show us father-like love, care & concern (as they would), but can we have & demonstrate the same fear (in respect to their nature & position)? When considering & applying this to myself, I have to answer, No. The healthy fear (respect) I had for my earthly father, even enjoying his love & care, was clearly different to my understanding, attitude & approach to my heavenly Father. GBU.
In the past I was troubled by having two different feelings. One feeling that says that God is your dear Father who loves till death and a feeling that says that God is a fearsome, powerful God, with whom one should keep a distance from. After all He is God, not a man. Two opposite feelings.
One time as I was trying one more time to think what is the proper way to approach and think of God, I just asked my wife what she thinks of it. And she said something very simple to me," how would you like your son to see you and approach you?" And I said that I would like my son to love me, to appreciate what I have done for him, to trust me that I want the best for him and to respect me as a father. I would never liked that my son fears me, I would feel like a failed father if that had happened. So she said it is the same with God. Love Him, trust in Him, appreciate what He has done and doing for you and respect Him like a Father but do not fear Him. He wouldn't like this. Fear God means respect God as a Father.
So we should not fear God BUT we should fear about our salvation and be very serious about it. Philippians 2:12, "12Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling." Let us obey God, let us not play games with sin, be careful, stay away from anything that could turn us to a different direction than that of the narrow way, along Jesus' footprints, which ends up in Heaven, Every other way leads somewhere else, not in Heaven.
I should fear God, just like I fear my parents. I do my best to love and have a high respect for my earthly fathers, in the same or similar manner I believe I should respect and reverence God our Father. Now when the earth moves, and the waters are troubled and the wind and rain are hard to bear I can wonder is God trying to tell me something or get my attention. These calamities get my undivided attention, however although I believe these are acts of God I believe the cause most of the calamity is the sin in the earth atmosphere that puts these events in motion. I believe there is negative energy that is created from sin in the earth that triggers and puts negative events into motion. (now the negativity could be coming from any part of the earth not necessarily stemming from where a calamity has taken place)
I also believe God doesn't have fear, I believe only man has fear. My fear is an emotion, to help me to know or learn what I may be feeling. My fear helps me know not to do certain behaviors due to consequences, for example. Fear is a tool to help me learn however I should not abused fear, love also is an emotion that I can use to learn and I shouldn't abuse either.
The scripture tells us that God hates sin, man being born in sin, etc. is separated from God due to man's sin nature, Ah Ha, God provided an answer to remedy my separation from God and to bring me back in relationship with God, that remedy is salvation in Jesus Christ. The word salvation comes from salvage, God had a plan from the beginning to salvage my relationship with God.
I asked God why so much challenges, I believe I understand that God wants us to be like Him. His only begotten Son Jesus the Christ is our template. In order for me to be like God, I must go through trials and tribulation to best understand God by way of my own personal journey and personal relationship with God, disregarding the interference from others.
You wrote " I believe there is negative energy that is created from sin in the earth that triggers and puts negative events into motion."
This is actulaly what Paul says in Rom 8:19-22, "19For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth for the manifestation of the sons of God. 20For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope, 21Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God. 22For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until noW"
This world and the events that occuring is the result of man's disobedience in the Paradise. Nothing good, sin is dominating everything and everywhere. Apart from God's people. We belong to the Kingom of God and we are under His protection. Of course this doesn't mean that God has placed us inside a glassy cage where nothing touches us, we are still living in this sinful world and we are going through all that the rest are going through. But there is aiways a limit that God does not permit to exceed. And there will be a day that all that will end and we will be living on the new earth that He will create for us full of hapiness for ever. And with this hope we keep going in this life. Blessings.
Speaking from my own perception, and given whatever the Word reveals about the presence of God & His Character, I don't at all sense that He is a happy-go-lucky father figure, entertaining humor & jokes from the beings of Heaven, or even joining in the activities of Heaven. I realize that some believers may sense the opposite to what I do and that's okay, since I feel that after all, it can only be an individual's perception, unless we've had an Isaiah or Paul experience.
Therefore, the "fear of God" speaks to me of an Almighty, Holy, Everlasting God Who ever exists, thinks, behaves, & causes things to happen both within & without, in a way that is far removed from what an earthly father (or, man) could ever be, whether to his children, family or others. Yes, as we can run to our earthly father to express ourselves or needs, so too we can approach our heavenly Father in & through His Spirit within us. But the fact of the very Nature of God & His relation to all His creation, and without any similarity to our humaness, our God is truly to be feared for His Majesty, Wisdom, & Power. Do we just hold Him in awe & reverence, or do we (or should we) come before Him as those beholding His Glory, as no earthly father can produce or expect? Maybe, if we do receive a vision of His Glory, then the word "fear" will hold a greater, compelling, & worthier meaning to us. Blessings.
This is the problem brother. If one fears God since His is an Allmighty God, a God that millions of angels worship, and cherubims hide their faces infront of Him etc, then it is impossible for one to approach God as a beloved Father. For them God will always be a fearsome personality. Fear keeps one away from another person.
But inspite of all those, which are true, God is love. He is a "person" that descended from His highness in Heaven, He became one of us, not any man but a poor man, and tolerated so many bad things from people even accepted to be crucified, He actually aimed that. So we also speak about a humble God who emptied Himself from His powers and rights, full of love for mankind, ready to sacrifice Himself for us.
Jesus is God who became a man. Did His disciples or any other person fear Him? No, I don't think so. They were feeling a deep respect for Him, but no they were not afraid of Him. John in the last supper threw himself into Jesus' arms. That one can never do if they feel a fear, an awe for somebody.
Maybe I am wrong Chris, but I prefer to consider God the way I am considering Him, a dear father who is not hard to approach, ready to throw myself into His arms. I could not do this if I feel even a little bit of fear. Fear would always keep me away. Of course this does not mean that I could play and joke with God. No I do not mean that.
Well, I will be thinking of your comment. Thanks brother. GBU
Thanks bro. Giannis for these further thoughts for contemplation. I fully understand what you're saying here, in respect to how one should look to God as our heavenly Father Who reached down to us, emptying Himself to demonstrate to us & effect His great love for us. So then it would seem incongruous to accept that such a loving God could also instil a 'fear' of Him in us. In regards to Jesus coming to Earth as a Man, we know that He laid aside His Glory for that to happen & become a Sacrifice for us; and as a Man, His disciples saw Him, touched Him, & spoke to Him, and probably only much later realizing that His Words were true, that He was indeed the One sent by the Father, from Heaven and Divine. That knowledge in itself should have prompted a special reverence towards Jesus that may not have been there before.
As Isaiah 6:1-7 reveals what Isaiah saw & experienced, even though we don't consider him to have that same salvation experience nor the Father-child relationship as we have, yet we do get a glimpse of how he was struck by this vision. So I sense that type of fear that was beyond a holy reverence, yet certainly not a fear of One Whom he should be fearful of & flee away from. From my understanding of the Word & my approach to it & before the Father, I cannot perceive Him as equivalent to my earthly father (deceased). Elements of such a relationship are similar, as we have discussed previously, but there needs to be something much greater & deeper than the earthly perspective. Onto Page 2.
Just as a side note: I don't know how the Greek refers to God (in the second person); i.e. is the same word used for 'you, your, yours', in Greek like we have in English? In the Indian sub-continent two main languages (Hindi, Urdu), different words are applied depending on whom we are speaking to. Whether speaking to an adult/respected person, or a child/servant, or to God, different words are used. In the Bibles used there, and not translated from the KJB, (Tu, Tera) are used of God & equivalent to our 'Thou, Thy, Thine'). It was thought inappropriate to use the generally 'better/acceptable' words for 'you' when addressing God in the Word or even in prayer (even as I still do). And why should this be, if we ought to consider God as a Father-figure to us with Whom we should easily relate to at any time, & little else?
I guess, that our own understanding of this matter reflects how we think of God in His Majesty & Power, how we read His Word, or address Him. It remains therefore one's personal belief in understanding this aspect of God and in no way belittling or condemning another for believing differently. The LORD still loves us & accepts us fully in and through His Son. GBU.
Grace is not unmerited favor, it is the spirit of conviction your heart to obey. (G5485) it's NOT "legalism" it's LOVE ( 1 John 5:3) We've got to be obedient to his 2 covenants of promise (10 commandments and rainbow covenat "eat clean") thats what Christ(Yeshua) magnified and made honorable, just like his very own character and life was pleasing unto God(Yahovah) he opened the door for all nations to enter that covenant verbally presented and agreed to at the rock at Horeb, and *then* written in stone at Mt Sinai. but Israel had already transgressed that agreement ( Exodus 19 & 20) when Moses came down with the 10 commandments in writing. *then* the sacrificial law was added until Christ(Yeshua) would finish the punishment with a perfect sacrifice, effectively restoring the original covenant (10 commandments.) Moses prophesies about ending the punishment of the sacrificial law here in Deuteronomy 18:15-19 but never did the eternal 10 comandments go away. now because the 10 northern tribe were scattered into all the world via mixing seed(mixed offspring) the covenant is open to ALL nations and people. There's many false gospels and dangerous doctrines of men, mixing holy and profane, teaching traditions as commandments while tossing out the actual commandments, ( Matt 24)
this is why he said "narrow is the path, few will find it." - Matt 7:14
Love your neighbor according to scripture - James 2:8 what scripture? Leviticus 19:15-18.
(straitisthegate dot net)
To be honest I don't understand what you want to say. Do you mean if we use plural when we talk or pray to God like we do when we talk to an adult/respected person? The answer is no we don't. We use plural (in grk "you" in singular is a different word from "you" in plural) when talking to a respected person but not for God. Generally speaking we use the same words for God as for any other person.
Rather than focussing on grammar (which is helpful), the point of this thread is 'how should we understand God's Nature, as both One of great Majesty & Power yet now approachable by His blood-bought children calling Him 'Abba'? This apparent dichotomy is probably only resolved if God Himself by His Spirit, reveals something more of Himself to us, that might cause us to combine a loving Father-like figure with One before Whom all should tremble ( Psalm 99:1-5). Here then is where i see both the similarity & difference when comparing our LORD God to our earthly father. True, both show us father-like love, care & concern (as they would), but can we have & demonstrate the same fear (in respect to their nature & position)? When considering & applying this to myself, I have to answer, No. The healthy fear (respect) I had for my earthly father, even enjoying his love & care, was clearly different to my understanding, attitude & approach to my heavenly Father. GBU.
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