Discuss Ecclesiastes 9 Page 2

Singing songs of praise is one way of praising God. Also seek out things in your life and give thanks to God for them. The more you do these things the more comfortable you will become and your heart will open up to Him. Also confess to the Lord you need help in praising Him and He will help you.

I have been been praising GOD every day. I was told that you do not keep saying the same thing, even praying. How do i prayse GOD every day with out repeating myself? Do you prayse GOD every day. I need help for this.

Robert Johnstone

Hello my brother Philip!

I too have been studying the bible for over 40 years. I hope this helps. First someone in heaven now. Yes!

First Enoch. Gen. 5: 21-24. God took Enoch.

Second. Elijah. 2King 2:1-15. Elijah went to heaven on chariot of fire.

Third. Moses Jude verse 9. Michele and the devil fought for the body of Moses. Devil lost. Now go to Matthew 17: 1-13

Elijah and Moses appears to Jesus.

But you are right. Other then that everyone is still in the graves waiting for the second coming of Christ.

First go to John 11:11-16

Jesus tells apostles Lazarus is sleeping. The apostles had to be told sleep means dead.

Now go to Ecclesiastes 9:5-6 the dead now nothing. Meaning they are not in heaven. If in heaven they would know something. We believe that people sleep. When Christ comes the righteous will rise to go to heaven. Later the wick will rise together then punch.

Hope these helps. If you want more I will be happy to send more information.

God bless my friend.

Hey Jeff,

It will be hard to find, the closest you will get is a parable in Luke 16. If you read the chapter and the context it is against the love of money and wealth. When Jesus first came the Greek influence was widespread many were Hellenized.

When our spirit leaves our body and goes to intermediate heaven does not come from scripture, it comes from Plato. His definition of death is the separation of the soul from the body. Hades the Underworld where the dead went, a subterranean region, the world of the dead where all souls passed after their time on earth, Elysium was paradise.

If you look for scripture you will find sleep in the earth until the resurrection, Job 7:21 Job 14:12-14 Job 17:13-16 Psalm 89:48 Psalm 115:17 Daniel 12:2 Ecclesiastes 9:10

God bless,

RLW

Paul talked about being taken to the 3rd heaven in his vision or actually being taken he said he did not know but he saw heaven and describes as the 3rd heaven. Jesus told the thief today you shall be with me in paradise. Some say the air from the earth to the atmosphere is the 1st heaven from the atmosphere to heaven is the 2nd and beyond that is the 3rd heaven. The Catholic's believe in purgatory, and some equate paradise with that as being the same. We know upon Christ return the dead in Christ will be raised from the dead but so will the lost souls as well. Do we go to heaven when we die we know our bodies don't but what about our sours and our spirit? The belief is our spirit that God breathed into Adam that we all have that gives us life returns to God, but our soul which is us sleeps and the Bible often refers to death as sleep in both the old and new testaments. Genesis 1:8And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day. look at verses 6&7 6And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

7And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so. the firmament he called heaven? So if you go beyond Heaven you'll find water? notice Heaven is capitalized a place.

Psalms 49:15

"But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave: for he shall receive me. Selah." implies our soul is in the grave. Ecclesiastes 9:10

"Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest."

Psalms 30:3

"O LORD, thou hast brought up my soul from the grave: thou hast kept me alive, that I should not go down to the pit."

Ecclesiastes 3:21

"Who knoweth the spirit of man that goeth upward, and the spirit of the beast that goeth downward to the earth?"

That's all I got,

King James Version (KJV)

Please see these references: Mark 9:1-7, Matthew 17:2, Matthew 28:3, Luke 9:29, Revelation 19:11-16, Revelation 1:14, Mark 16:5, John 20:12, Acts 1:10, Ecclesiastes 9:8, Revelation 3:4,5, Revelation 7:9-17, Revelation 20:11, Isaiah 1:18, Revelation 6:2,11, Revelation 9:18, Daniel 11:35, Revelation 4:4, Daniel 7:9, Revelation 2:17, Daniel 12:10,

John 4:35,

But Also : Genesis 40:16-23, Joel 1:7, Leviticus 13, Revelation 15:6,

Hopefully these are helpful.

Hey Rick,

Death is something we all will face; many believe our body dies and our soul lives on. Is our soul immortal? Can we take 2 Corinthians 5:8 when we die our soul leaves our body and we are present with the Lord? Some define death as a separation of the soul from the body. Does that come from scripture? I have not found that in scripture.

It comes from Greek philosophy of Plato. He wrote the body is a prison for the soul and viewed death as the means of freedom for the soul. The philosophy of death started blending in the church in the second century and those good souls go to heaven and the bad goes to hell and more. Many see the parable in Luke 16:19-31 as fitting this. If you read the chapter Jesus is talking about the unrighteous love mammon and neglect the true riches.

My understanding from scripture every part of us is mortal and when we die, we sleep in the dust, Job 14:12-14, Job 17:13-16, Ecclesiastes 9:5-10 until resurrection. When this mortal puts on immortality 1 Corinthians 15:52-58, and we will be absent from this flesh body. Then those that are Christs will be judged and receive our rewards. Matthew 16:27, Revelation 22:12 that is our hope, 1 Thessalonians 2:19

We will sleep in the dust, Daniel 12:2, 1Theselonians 4:14 and this is not from heaven, it is from around the world to meet Jesus in the air coming down to Israel the start the 1000 years at His coming. Matthew 24:31 Zechariah 14:4.

This is my understanding of scripture.

God bless,

RLW

Here are several scriptures I found about death & after death : James 2:26, Ecclesiasticus 38:23, Ecclesiasticus 22:11, 2 Maccabees 7:36, 2 Maccabees 12:44, Ecclesiasticus 10:11, Ecclesiasticus 17:28, Baruch, 2:17, Psalms 88:10, Psalms 115:11, Ecclesiastes 9:5,

after death,: Matthew 17:1-3, Luke 7:12-16, Luke 8:49-56, John 11:21-45, Matthew 27:50-54, Luke 16:22-31, John 21:14, Acts 3:15, Acts 4:10, Mark 12:25,26,27, Luke 24:46, John 5:12, John 5:25, 1 Peter 1:3, 1 Peter 2:24, 1 Peter 4:5, Revelation 1:5, Revelation 1:18, Revelation 14:9-20, 1 Corinthians 15:20,21, 2 Timothy 4:1, 1 Thessalonians 4:16, 1 Thessalonians 1:10, Matthew 25:31-46, Romans 14:9, Matthew 22:32, Isaiah 26:19,

Hebrews 11:35, Revelation 20, 2 Esdras 2:16, Hebrews 6:2, Hebrews 9:14, Hebrews 11:4, Hebrews 13:20, Revelation 11:18,

Hopefully these are helpful.

Krystin,

I am sure you will get different replies on this, my understanding is close to what is in your post. Soul and spirit are two different words but seem to think of being the same and are hard to separate in our mind. What happens to these when we die there are different understandings, does the soul sleep in the earth with the body, or is it immortal and go to two different places?

The word soul in Hebrew is nephesh meaning a soul, living being, life, self, person, desire, passion, appetite, emotion. The Greek word psuche meaning the soul, life, self, a person's distinct identity.

The word spirit, the Bible writers used the Hebrew word ruach meaning breath, wind, spirit, or the Greek word pneuma also meaning wind, breath, spirit, when writing about the spirit.

Genesis 2:7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

The spirit goes back to God Ecclesiastes 12:7

The Holy Spirit seals us until when? Ephesians 4:30

We are buried mortal, dead, in corruption and we are raised immortal incorruptible 1 Corinthians 15:42-44

All consciousness ends when we die. Psalm 6:5 Job 14:12-14 Job 17:13-16 Psalm 89:48 Psalm 115:17 Ecclesiastes 9:5-10

We sleep in the dust until resurrection day, the day of redemption. 1 Corinthians 15:51 1 Thessalonians 4:14 1 Corinthians 15:52-54

God raised Jesus from the dead after three days and three nights, so, Romans 8:1 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

Have not found any scripture that says we or our soul or spirit is immortal, may someone else provide it if it is in the bible.

God bless,

RLW

Dear Reynaldo,

I understand that it is culture. Thanks for clarifying since it seems to matter much to you.

Sigmund Freud called it talk therapy which is still used today in mental health care. we are doing more for mental health disease. In this discipline we use it to get things out in the open for our Savior to be beckon.

Lord, it is tight to give you thanks and praise, please hear my plea. Raul was my favorite Uncle and in life he served you Lord, with a contrite heart. As I talk about our past with Raul for closer it is without expecting an answer form my Uncle Raul. Let others learn from my plea. Through Jesus Christ we pray. Amen.

biting the forbidden fruit was also a thought.

it was wrong and it is still talked about it today.

misunderstanding a definition or any false assumptions caters to the evil one.

letting go of something for self-perseverance reminds me of the quote " you are in America, you can want all you want, but it doesn't make it right. btw. It is not heritage, it is culture.

That's a good verse. I was forgiven of a lot of low-living. I was peeled just like an onion; piece by piece until I was bare and Had NOTHING to save me. A very bad time. Death looked good to me. But Jesus dropped into my wreckage and pulled me up to the land of the living.

After I'd been saved some months I leaped into evangelism. You know wee kids with their Daddies taking them out trick r treating? I felt like the Lord was with me no matter all the mess. I fell in with a storefront church; most of them were street preachers. I heard the Call. Thirty years later, it's still my passion.

All that discussion of sharing hopes of seeing my saved relatives someday in heaven_is externalizing. I know they're dead, gee whiz. My Favorite times are sharing my soul-winning prayers with the LORD OF THE HARVEST. If I see disasters on tv, I pray about everything! It's an on-going conversation with the Holy Spirit. He lives in me, and I live in Him. He desires to have relationship with US. Im sorta solitary, but have kids and I love them enough to keep a wall of prayer around them; and extended family too. I care deeply about war vets who are closed off inside their pain. I stand in the gap for them. Satan hates my guts and I give him lotsa trouble. He fights dirty and I fight as Jesus taught me: on my knees in prayer and exceeding Praise of the Lord!

Television is not real life. It's like opium. You don't feel life anymore.

I watch news of Signs of the Time. Jesus said to watch and Look Up, which is what most of us are doing. We're missing signs. All hell is busting out. Do you see it?

We are given Dominion, Power and Authority to open eyes and ears in the Name of Jesus. Remind Satan he's NOT human and has no authority to destroy a life. He's the ultimate ILLEGAL ex-archangel. He stirred up storms on Job. He's still doing it. SO PRAY LIKE A CHILD OF GOD. Use your authority in Jesus's Name. Send them into wilderness. Then praise JESUS for the victory.

Mishael The simple answer is most people don't believe the dead are dead as it says in Ecclesiastes 9:5+6.

Mishael,

I never said that we should not recall and remember loved ones. I have no problem with visiting a grave or special place of one we have lost. The original topic was praying for the dead and attempting to make contact with them as Reynaldo spoke about in the Day of the Dead practices e mentioned.

I know everyone has ways to remember loved ones who have died. As family, we talk a lot about my dad and his quirkiness and laugh. So, I really doo not think I am hammering anyone. My post must have struck a nerve and I am sorry that it did, but my intentions was to address the topic of praying for or to those who have died, especially if one is trying to make contact with a dead loved one. I have read your many posts about warding off demonic influences, and I think these practices open up such doorways for demons to interact with people. So, that is why I am speaking against these practices.

God Bless You this Day, Mishael

Mishael Why are we throwing out scripture if its all Gods Word 2 Timothy 3:16?

If it is necromancy to "talk" to the dead, why then do we have funerals and build graveyards with roads so we can put flowers on the grave? Sit on a bench and REMEMBER that persons life?

Is it just an industry someone invented? Why do we use graveyards? Isn't it a waste of prime real estate?

Why did Michael the Archangel (the Angel of War) fight with satan over Moses's body?

Why do we have a huge complex in Wash DC in honor of unknown dead soldiers?

I don't know. I miss my parents and sometimes I talk to the air and remember good things they did for me.

It's really uptight and sorta mean, to hammer people for missing loved ones. We should just throw out these scriptures below,

1 Thessalonians 4:18; 5:11

Wherefore comfort one another

Gigi I understand are you still interested.

Raynaldo,

Thank you for sharing more about the Day of the Dead. I understand that it is part of your heritage.

I still think that it is necromancy when one tries to contact someone wo is deceased to converse with them or have them present in a situation, regardless if there is fortune telling or "magic" involved. So, I do not do it, myself.

As to speaking to Jesus, we are encouraged to pray to God and the Holy spirit interacts with us. That is different. One is dealing with God, who is unique and in a class of Being all by himself. It differs from "communicating" to or with people who have died. But I can let this conversation go for today. Thanks for you input.

Raynaldo,

I am not sure if you understood me correctly in what I said about my dad. e was a believer and God took him before we were ready, but we accept that God makes the best decisions. He was merciful to my dad in taking him before e had to suffer the effects of emphysema whatever else old age would have brought him. My mom, siblings, and I all recognize this. As to being a caregiver for someone close to us. Most of us who know the Lord do so with love and concern for that person. But it is hard to do for some because they themselves may be advanced in years and the work is taxing on them. The neighbor my Mom spoke to is in her 80's, too, and her and her husband still live together in a condo. she has some outside help come in daily. That is all I was saying. I think you over-spiritualized it a bit.

Good Morning rick, I was referring to the temple and the tabernacle. Thanks for asking.

Well said Michael. Thank you. God Bless you today

necromancy is talking to the dead about fortune telling or magic. not just talking to the dead as you stated, Edmund Freud is the father of talk therapy, Carl Jung continued his work. That thought or discipline is used today to help heal others that need closer in their lives.

Consider reading slower for understanding to gain wisdom. TJCWP.

Through Jesus Christ we pray. Amen.

sometimes we are selfish in our wants and needs. many bad parents, evil men or women were gone before their time.

As you stated, taking care of a loved one can seem impossible and sometimes it is or just not doable. The evil persons that are not taken (have died) and need caring can be supported even if we don't think they deserve it. We would rather hang and/or imprison them than rehab them as their choices are not our problem.

God is merciful, don't be afraid. Stating that it is bad for others to care for the sick when not able to, in your stated case, and calling it merciful by God's hand is misaligned. Do not be afraid. Pray for the ones that are in need of understanding of their merciful and serving life's. Through Jesus Christ we pray. Amen.

it is necromancy when talking to the dead about fortune telling, talking to the dead is not necromancy. I talk to Jesus Christ all the time with a contrite heart through prayer and because I know he will listen.

I hold that steadfastly and it's in "The Holy Bible."

Day of the dead has been observed for over 3,000 years. These days Catholics honor those that have gone before us on November 1st (for children) and November 2nd (for adults.) It is raining heavily every day, somewhere. It doesn't mean loss is all there is! When we ask for the dead to come celebrate this one day with us it is talk to them to exchange words unsaid. We also dawn on a skeleton mask to scare them off after this day of talk therapy, we don't want them to stick around... read about talk therapy that is still used today in Psychology and Psychiatric Counseling. Freud fathered it and Carl Jung embellished it. We use talk therapy all over the world in Education, and in business (naming a couple of disciplines) to meet the needs of the world we live in. Without talking it out we wouldn't have the written language. Without talking we might as well be mute. Get it out of your system, out of your heart, ie. love, for it is right to give him thanks and praise. Have you ever met Jesus Christ our Savior? Neither have I, but I still talk to the Lord, our God.

I can go on, so I will. Spanish was the first language I spoke, English 2nd. years later I mastered the English vernacular as I was born in America. Through pictures and visions, along with mentors of many ethnicities I learned to learned and it garnered me wisdom that I use today to help our living brothers and sisters in Christ. We do not forget our ancestral history. We must not forget those that gave us our freedom that we have today. Are we to embellish those attributes and be idle? There are many ways of life, together we can seek truth. Just imagine it and then live it. Through Jesus Christ we pray, Amen.

Gigi Did you want to know any more about the tabernacle or the way the truth and the life statement we

discussed briefly, if not moving on.

We will see them again. My sons cousin, same age, died in a 18 wheeler crash. His buddy driver had too much to drink that day and couldn't drive. My nephew did back to back shifts.

He fell asleep. Was observed going off road, and the truck leaped a storm culvert. He died instantly. He was like a son to me.

Loss teaches us the brevity of life. To let go of all the issues, and just love. Live well and know we'll see them again.

Be wise as a serpent; mild as a dove. If we discern evil, we must cover with our prayers. Fight like the Lion of Judah. My son blamed God and walked away from Him. I prayed for 20 years! He's back now. Has asked to be restored.

Don't give up on those who hurt. Pray for them to meet the Healer and Lover of our souls.

Agreed, Rick. We are among the living here on earth and our focus should be one those we have fellowship here and now. We can pray for each other, but not for the dead. We can trust that God judges justly in all things and rest in that. If someone dies a believer, our fellowship will be renewed in the resurrection, until then, it is advised for people to stay away from anything that involves praying to or contacting the dead. It is prohibited in Scripture, called necromancy, a type of divination.

Bless You Mishael, That is a story of hard losses in a short time. I am sorry it was that way, but God chooses what is best, I believe.

My dad died 32 years ago when I was 32. He had two back to back heart attacks within hours of each other and was gone quickly. Today, I was visiting my 88 year old Mom and she mentioned to me how she had talked with someone who was our neighbor for many years. Her husband is in a wheelchair now, having had several strokes. She is caregiving for him. so my mom mentioned, that it was a blessing that my dad died as e did, because she thinks it would be so hard for her to do caregiving for him now. So that was good to hear her say that. I miss my dad, but I know he had the beginnings of emphysema and is later years would have been miserable for him. God was merciful to him.