Romans Chapter 13 Discussion Page 4

everything has it's good

Names that refer to God (Devine) should have at least the first letter in capital.

Joe, yes, Rom 13:1-7 does refer to the governments & legal system that have rule & authority by God to administer the necessary laws for the protection & welfare of society. And the apostle Paul states that we are to be subject to them because they are divinely appointed or even permitted by God to perform those functions.

But your question & this passage raises other issues which may be perplexing to those who may be subject to the directives & laws of their governments that are actually "a terror to good works or don't appear to be God's minister executing wrath upon the evil". Of course, in our musings, we are reminded that Paul wrote all this whilst under the authority of the Roman government, which was renowned for its ruthless wickedness. So we have no excuse to debate this issue when our own governments appear to fall far short of God's Standards or of Paul's own instructions to us to obey such systems.

So, in light of Scripture, I believe we still need to obey, or sometimes suffer, under our governments, as they are appointed by God, however knowing that most governments are godless by nature, we have to decide whether there is conflict by what they require and what God requires. So, I believe that in spite of this Romans passage which can be troubling to some who are under repressive & godless governments, believers are still in a position to obey them & come under their rule, yet oppose governmental directives & laws where they clearly oppose God's Directives to us. I personally find this Romans passage one of those difficult portions of Scripture to fully reconcile.

I have a Question:Is Romans Chpt13 vas.1-7 talking about our leaders of our country or what is meant by the higher powers?

Hi, True, but even the stars of God call men to repentance. Josephus the historian, said something similar happened with Abraham.

On the justification of Abraham, did this happen also outside of the law?

Scripture tells us, nobody ever sought God. The Lord Jesus said, no one can come to me except the Father, which has sent me,draws. Everyone that hath learned of the Father cometh unto me. He that cometh unto me, (in that way) I will in no wise cast out. Other place, therefore I said unto you, ye cannot come unto me, except the Father draws him. From that many walked no more with Him. For a natural man standing next to Him, this is the normal response. Everyone spiritually dead will react the same way, for

He that worketh not, but believeth on Him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. No works of man,period. Romans 4: 3-4.

The people wanted a king, but God sends leanness in their souls. God gave David being a king after His own heart and Israel was blessed. Rulers who ignore God, are rulers of darkness.

Certainly God hears the prayers of the unsaved! Otherwise, how would He hear your cry for repentance and prayer FOR salvation.

God is ever present, always watching, always listening to all mankind. If you are unsaved, today is the day to repent of your sins, believe that Jesus was born of a virgin, died on Calvary to take your place, arose the third day, and is sitting at the Father's right hand making intercession for you and me every time we sin. I pray you will trust Him as your Savior and become a child of God. All you have to do is repent, believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God and accept His salvation! Don't delay, He's coming soon!!!!

God gave Hitler his power (Saul wasn't merciful either, but he was made King of Israel by God himself), therefore, if your ruler is bad, you have to obey him, and not kill him not damage his government via terrorism or other methods.

Even the antichrist need God's approval in order to obtain power.

We are to love what God loves and hate what God hates. The evil in our land with all these anarchists is not to be tolerated. They are calling good evil and evil good. Pray that God will win this fight for us, because we can not win this battle between good and evil without Him. Thank you.

Robert,

I was unable to respond, as the thread was locked for additional comment. So I am responding here.

The parable of the sower describes four different heart conditions. The condition you bring up is the person represented by the stony ground. They get excited about the things the Lord. They began to blossom with their emotion right away. You begin to see those signs above ground, and it appears to be instant growth. So this person gets excited, but then when it's time to start maturing in the Lord, which comes through trials and tribulations, that person is immediately offended.

They don't have that happy feeling anymore, they are not excited anymore. Now it is time for growth. Now it is time to settle down with the Lord, and they get offended and they leave. That person was never saved. This is not a person that was once saved, and then walked away and lost their salvation. They were never saved, period.

In the Parable of the Sower, there's only one person out of these four that are saved. Only one person bears the fruit of salvation, and that's our number four man. None of the other three bear fruit, meaning none of the other three represent salvation.

It seems as though you are saying that belief in a pre-tribulation rapture would cause someone to be persecuted, or perhaps cause them to forfeit their salvation? Am I just misunderstanding you? Jesus said we can expect persecution for His name's sake. It should be no surprise to us if we are persecuted for identifying with Christ. Thanks for caring about me. I care about you also. But don't be too concerned for me because I believe in Pre-trib. That will not separate me from Christ. I thank you for the YouTube invite, but something deep inside my spirit tells me I need to be cautious, so I will respectfully decline.

Pray for understanding j shall RECEIVE understanding

I been giving three sentyse smells in different times and I am trying to understand what the Lord is trying to tell me. The smells fresh water, fresh dirt , honey suckle flowers

Does God hear and answer prayers of the unsaved ?

Emil, a definite NO: Hitler can NEVER be referred to as God's Minister. If for nothing else, he did everything that was opposed to the Bible & the Message of Love & Compassion that were Jesus' foundational teaching. I think you may have heard something that has made you wonder about Hitler's religious stance, rather than your personal belief. I truly hope it's not your belief.

From a religious viewpoint, you're correct, he was raised a Roman Catholic & received its rites, though always in conflict with its teachings, indeed of Christianity itself. Hitler, was essentially a megalomaniac (one who is mentally ill resulting in delusions of greatness about himself; & we likely have some around us now!) & a Gnostic, who, in one of its beliefs, considers one's own knowledge & mental prowess, to be above virtue & godliness. If anything, he was AN anti-Christ, of whom some in his day, even considered him to be THE one, but as Mickey has well described him: he is "like a choir boy compared to what the Antichrist has planned for the world". An apt description, as if a German (or an ally) was obedient & subservient to the Nazi philosophy & rules, then he got on okay; just as in the day of The Anti-Christ, when one is fully obedient to him. If any opposed him, the results would be horrific.

comment by Alex about y Jesus was born. It was that he might be multiplied in our hearts via a seed resulting from his death, when a seed dies it multiplies ( our new heart and new spirit ) is th result of his death,smite the shephard and the sheep will be scattered then i will turn my hand to the little ones a baby Christ which is the H.G. AS THAT WHICH IS BORN OF THE SPIRIT IS SPIRIT OUR NEW INNERMAN has to be born in us. That was the great Promise in the beginning I will multiply thy seed as the stars of heaven speaking of abrahams' heavenly seed Christ Jesus. Thats y th woman ( humanity ) is giving birth simply b/c of his death, the only way we can see him is by his death, he said unless a seed dies it abides alone ( just 1 christ ) but if it dies it will bring forth much fruit (many Christ as the stars of heaven ) That was the great Promise,The fruit is his offspring the H.G. an Isrsel of God ,the multiplication of very God in humanity via his seed sown in us sinners. Being bornagain of an incorruptible seed even by the Word of God but there wd have been no seed if he had not died,when a seed dies it multiplies that all the world might get a seed an incorruptible seed that is gonna destroy our old adamic nature thus destroying satans head mans adamic nature that is in rank with satans head.outta of the hearts of man proceeds all manner of evil, Thats y he refers to the H.G as the PROMISE,THE H.G is the multiplication of Christ that results from his seed th word th new covenant in our hearts thus a spritual pregnancy resulting in a Child, she brought forth a man child that is gonna rule all nations. The Child is the h.g. that is gonna rule all nations as Jesus said the spirit of truth is gona reprove the world of sin and righteous and judgement which answers to the kingdom of GOD coming from with in US. The reason issac was born was that abraham might be multiplied,The reason Jesus was born was that God might be multiplied in US sinners remember the PROMISE GB

Who told you that?

Hitler was not a Christian; not a minister of God.

His deeds were evil. He was a follower of Satan. He murdered over 6 million Jewish men, grandmothers, grandfathers, women, children, babies, so satan could destroy Gods people. Hurt God.

The only reason to remember his name is to warn people now that Hitler will seem like a choir boy compared to what the Antichrist has planned for the world. Repent

Be born again now. Choose Life. Help people you love, be born again too. Time is short.

Based on Romans 13:4; How can Hitler be a minister of God?

"Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation." 2 Peter 1:20 We must remember there is only 1 way to understand God's Word. That one way is the true way God intended. There are no "interpretations". That is man's lie. I have trouble understanding things in the Bible too - I pray to God to increase my faith and help me understand. He always answers this prayer, because it is His will we understand! Go with the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, brother!

yes I have a question wat iz paul actually saying here in verse 1 thru verse 4 of Romans 13 and thank you in advance for your reply.

Hi Dawn - the greatest commandment is: Love God above all, love thy neighbor as thyself. Following God requires love of Him first, and following His ways.

Paul is telling us to wake up.. Get dress and get to work.. God's work ...The greatest commandment...love thy neighbor as yourself... God bless you

Paul here is talking about the Ministers referring them as Rulers over the church. God was warning the church to obey the powers they Ministers are operating, it will be damnation to you when you disobey the power of God.

Verse 11 Wake up Verses 12 and 13 Get up Verses 14 Get dressed! And go to work for the cause of Christ!

It is good if I could understand it, And I Love the Word of God Ican't intrpet it.

These gods you trust will flee. For it is written, And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sits on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:

All That is Listed is of God. Whosoever Resisteth The Powers that are Ordained of God, Shall Receive to Themselves Damnation. For Rulers are Not a Terror to Good Works but to The Evil( Romans 13:1-14) Put Them in Mind to be Subject to Principalities and Powers to Obey Magistrates, Speak Evil of No Man, For You were Sometimes Foolish and Disobedient etc. ( Titus 3:1-15) Christ Died For Your Sins

All things you list are temporal, carnal, devised by men of the world; and cannot pluck from the hand of my Holy Father. Wisdom is to fear God, not man: but ye wicked attempt to prolong with fear. But now ye, having killed Christ, are afraid putting forth vanities for shew. For this very cause it is written, Be not afraid of them that kill the body, and after that have no more that they can do.

Those Verses are Used. We all Need Law Enforcement,The Courts, Jails, Prisons, The Gallows. We Need to Pay Our Taxes to Keep Things Running. The Armed Forces Help to Protect Us and Others, it Gives Some of Us an Income. Without The System Charlie Manson would be on Every Corner. The Cowardly Run From The System.